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View Full Version : PROS and CONS of BL ?



providen1990
12-29-2010, 04:03 PM
^^ just want to know because i cant think of any pros of bl

LєthalHeart
12-29-2010, 04:07 PM
high hp
high def
high attack
CD/CR built in skills
high def rate
high attack rate
highly customizable
beast buffs, low cooldowns




^^i just told you the pros because i cant think of any cons of bl

Tysukiomi
12-29-2010, 04:10 PM
^_^ yesh, we are pretty epic characters :O

XFearMyBladeX
12-29-2010, 04:49 PM
only thing bad with bls is that they r not immune to MF,they need to use a suit or boots with mp.besides that, bl just RULE

Tysukiomi
12-29-2010, 04:56 PM
only thing bad with bls is that they r not immune to MF,they need to use a suit or boots with mp.besides that, bl just RULE

its why you hit 155ish and max an mp rune out

XFearMyBladeX
12-29-2010, 04:59 PM
its why you hit 155ish and max an mp rune out

u still need a battler ammy.

Tysukiomi
12-29-2010, 05:00 PM
u still need a battler ammy.

lol well i use one :) so thats why

MaxUchiha
12-29-2010, 05:51 PM
u still need a battler ammy.
o.O my bl had 13x mp with +5 earrings and lvl 5 mp rune

EDIT: and eww battler ammy

providen1990
12-29-2010, 05:53 PM
Well i mean cons and pros on pve,pvp,duel,dungeon,war....
All i have seen is this:
soloable dungeon(aos1,ic1,ft1...): we cant run faster than a wa with his 300add atk
party dungeon(ft2,aps2,ic2): well it is obvious noone want us in pt zzzzz
pve: i think this is our good part ^^
pvp(war channel, training spot): not = to wa(higher hp,damage,def),fs(AOD,high def),fb(I love you >.<♥I love you >.<♥I love you >.<♥ debuff)
duel: we arent bad at this
war: our bm2 is bad in war single target and low 1 hit damage, we cant use dps in war because the fact that we need more than 15-20hits to kill one person if we use dps combo we dont have range skill(well we have one but it is just weak) so when we get root ^^ zzzzz

providen1990
12-29-2010, 06:03 PM
high hp yes lower than wa(300hp i think)though but we have great hp
high def yes
high attack: after wa wiz fa ^^ so we are below average
CD/CR built in skills: this isnt a pros because the actually damage output are the same or weaker than other class
high def rate yea but it doesnt affect alot
high attack rate yea but it doesnt affect alot
highly customizable no idea ^^
beast buffs, low cooldowns: what are u talking about o.O
also if u play a bl u can see how much our stuff cost especially helm, blade which are the most potential
let discuss this tonight guy we have M/A nothing to do so stick to my theard and have fun ^^

Tysukiomi
12-29-2010, 06:29 PM
>_> tellt he low atk to my 1004 atk -_-

David
12-29-2010, 06:32 PM
it seems like u are comparing bl to wa and fa... learn to play ur char.all classes have pros and cons .. ya every1 knows bl in pve is awesome.talking about war/pk/pvp:war seems like u dont know how to use ur bms/debuffs/skills when there is a big group of procs just go bm1+aura+immunity u will pwn the hell out of them(if ur dmg is good lol)when u attacking a groupd of procs since bl has a rlly good aoe u will be hitting more than 1 at the same time.when u talk about fb debuffs vs bl every1 knows fb r a pain in the ars with debuffs only advantage fb have vs bl is the mana freeze besides that bl can beat a fb by only using intu and immunity.bl bm2 isnt bad go a 1 vs 1 bm2 fight and see who wins lol bl have a rlly good base attack already,plus the skills cd and cr bonus.u saying wa have more hp but bl r alot more faster and our dps>wa... bl range in war u can use TM>FK>....... tm knocks u down 90% of the time also once u r near target it is not easy to sta away from bl (unless u r a wiz)... hint dont be a nub and use forcy instead of titanium(pretty sure thats what u using some tit pc dmg extended +10 or something ) lol

Tysukiomi
12-29-2010, 06:34 PM
it seems like u are comparing bl to wa and fa... learn to play ur char.all classes have pros and cons .. ya every1 knows bl in pve is awesome.talking about war/pk/pvp:war seems like u dont know how to use ur bms/debuffs/skills when there is a big group of procs just go bm1+aura+immunity u will pwn the hell out of them(if ur dmg is good lol)when u attacking a groupd of procs since bl has a rlly good aoe u will be hitting more than 1 at the same time.when u talk about fb debuffs vs bl every1 knows fb r a pain in the ars with debuffs only advantage fb have vs bl is the mana freeze besides that bl can beat a fb by only using intu and immunity.bl bm2 isnt bad go a 1 vs 1 bm2 fight and see who wins lol bl have a rlly good base attack already,plus the skills cd and cr bonus.u saying wa have more hp but bl r alot more faster and our dps>wa... bl range in war u can use TM>FK>....... tm knocks u down 90% of the time also once u r near target it is not easy to sta away from bl (unless u r a wiz)... hint dont be a nub and use forcy instead of titanium(pretty sure thats what u using some tit pc dmg extended +10 or something ) lol

:) someone who actually knows what hes saying
+1
usualy the damage in bm1+aura is amazing since it gonna add alot of cdi and enough rate to remove all rate gears and still have max rate :)

David
12-29-2010, 06:39 PM
almost forgot ppl actually need bls in dungeons here r the reasons:example bosses spikes(ppl avoid the spikes by sending bl using intuition first so they wont get hit and the spike is over so rest of party can move to kill boss;when rest of party dies and boss is almost dead just go into and u can solo it[i have seen lost of bls saving dungeons runs when rest of party dies and they end soloing boss]).when bls extend either in bm1 or bm2 and they use all their debuffs IT IS A HELL OF NASTY DMG .. just saying also bl can tank ... it is just some of lots of reasons bls STILL RULE

providen1990
12-29-2010, 07:30 PM
about atk we have 0.25 per point fa have 0.3 wiz 0.33 wa 0.3 fs 0.24 fb 0.25 so our atk places at 4th so you can say that we have average atk not high ^^
about war/pvp first u cant use combo dps as i said u will need alot of hits to kill 1 target u will probably broke combo and die also your in war everyone def is usually over 1k or they use bm2 or aura which reduce dps combo damage output alot, second our aoe skills are ls,dt,sg,bs which dont give u a good dps, third immunity cool down is 5 mins man @@, fourth noone use bm2 to 1vs1 in war, and in pvp noone going to fight if u go bm2 they just run and come back when your bm2 wear off u cant get them in bm2 if they run
about dung if u are making a pt for high lvl dung you will probably chose first a wiz then 1-3 wa then fb then fa then bl then fs that is the order and u can see that it is not good ^^. even our dps in bm2 is weaker than wa
about the bm1 thing i like that too and this is the only thing we have in war but it isnt that great like what your guy said
and yea i have never seen a bl get near top 3 in war ^^ also if u are 170 and above u will see there isnt alot of bl there @@

David
12-29-2010, 07:50 PM
about atk we have 0.25 per point fa have 0.3 wiz 0.33 wa 0.3 fs 0.24 fb 0.25 so our atk places at 4th so you can say that we have average atk not high ^^
about war/pvp first u cant use combo dps as i said u will need alot of hits to kill 1 target u will probably broke combo and die also your in war everyone def is usually over 1k or they use bm2 or aura which reduce dps combo damage output alot, second our aoe skills are ls,dt,sg,bs which dont give u a good dps, third immunity cool down is 5 mins man @@, fourth noone use bm2 to 1vs1 in war, and in pvp noone going to fight if u go bm2 they just run and come back when your bm2 wear off u cant get them in bm2 if they run
about dung if u are making a pt for high lvl dung you will probably chose first a wiz then 1-3 wa then fb then fa then bl then fs that is the order and u can see that it is not good ^^. even our dps in bm2 is weaker than wa
about the bm1 thing i like that too and this is the only thing we have in war but it isnt that great like what your guy said
and yea i have never seen a bl get near top 3 in war ^^ also if u are 170 and above u will see there isnt alot of bl there @@

lol man what sup with u and dps lol bl have different kind of dps combination with heavy class u need like 3-4 or maybe only 2 dps skills and rest heavy and puff target is dead.at war if u know what to do and how u r fine u just need to learn to play ur bl...... heavy mos of the ppl use like 2 max 4 dps skills and then full heavy lol also idk if u havent notice but when bls crtic thats some nasty dmg... u saying immunity is "only" 50 secs but dude bm1+aura thats all the time u need to pwn a group of ppl lol
lol also what sup with u and ur dungeons party now max u need (depends on dungeon lvl)is like 5 max.... like i said before bls have saved dungeons runs lots of times by ending soloing bosses.
and lol "bm1 isnt as great as i say"?i just gonna say " LOL"...

Tysukiomi
12-29-2010, 08:00 PM
honestly, you are a freaking retard if you dont think blader bm1 is great
+45%rate +45% cdi, add aura, +16%rate +16%cdi
total of
61 rate(not even gonna need that much, so take off a rol and add cr)
and 61cdi(i ususaly take BOTH rol off at this point so its 81cdi)
so in reality, if i add in rate from skills my rate is ALWAYS 50 and my cdi is increased by 81 -_- gtf0 of here with that "bm1 isnt great" bs

Tysukiomi
12-29-2010, 08:01 PM
now just add a legacy weapon son

David
12-29-2010, 08:02 PM
honestly, you are a freaking retard if you dont think blader bm1 is great
+45%rate +45% cdi, add aura, +16%rate +16%cdi
total of
61 rate(not even gonna need that much, so take off a rol and add cr)
and 61cdi(i ususaly take BOTH rol off at this point so its 81cdi)
so in reality, if i add in rate from skills my rate is ALWAYS 50 and my cdi is increased by 81 -_- gtf0 of here with that "bm1 isnt great" bs


wait the answer he normally ask around for info and then type ... lol

XFearMyBladeX
12-29-2010, 08:05 PM
honestly, you are a freaking retard if you dont think blader bm1 is great
+45%rate +45% cdi, add aura, +16%rate +16%cdi
total of
61 rate(not even gonna need that much, so take off a rol and add cr)
and 61cdi(i ususaly take BOTH rol off at this point so its 81cdi)
so in reality, if i add in rate from skills my rate is ALWAYS 50 and my cdi is increased by 81 -_- gtf0 of here with that "bm1 isnt great" bs

lol bl bm1 isnt great dude bl bm1 is one of the best bm1 in game best for me is fb and bl.

Tysukiomi
12-29-2010, 08:06 PM
lol bl bm1 isnt great dude bl bm1 is one of the best bm1 in game best for me is fb and bl.

:( do u stalk me on forum?><
everytime i post you post:(

XFearMyBladeX
12-29-2010, 08:08 PM
:( do u stalk me on forum?><
everytime i post you post:(

o.0 lol no i only post when theres something funny or retard

providen1990
12-29-2010, 08:10 PM
isnt great compare to wa bm2 , fb bm1 sometime wiz bm2 ^^! u still dead pretty fast in bm1
also u will need to wait immunity to use with bm1 or bm2 in war or else u get rooted and when bl get root they cant do anything
my dps skill doesnt work at all in war -,- the damage output is too low i just use all heavy skills.
there is a reason why bl cant score high in war and there are no bl bringer up to this point

XFearMyBladeX
12-29-2010, 08:16 PM
isnt great compare to wa bm2 , fb bm1 sometime wiz bm2 ^^! u still dead pretty fast in bm1
also u will need to wait immunity to use with bm1 or bm2 in war or else u get rooted and when bl get root they cant do anything
my dps skill doesnt work at all in war -,- the damage output is too low i just use all heavy skills.
there is a reason why bl cant score high in war and there are no bl bringer up to this point

i think he was talking about bm1 not bm2 o.o like they said already u use ur skills depending on situation. adding the " u cant do nothing when u get rooted by a fb" is stupid cuz same happends with wiz and fs they dont have anti rooting buffs.if ur point that bls r weak cuz there is 0 bl bringer thats not a reason to believe bls r actually weak ^^

providen1990
12-29-2010, 09:12 PM
we dont talk about bm1 or bm2 we are talking about how u roll in war and yes bm2 of bl is kinda useless in war so all u have left is bm1
in mass war when a wiz get root in the middle he still can use his skills man but bl cant or u can use TM and some cannon XD. FS and WA also have some range in their skill
well so how can u explain why there are no bl bringer also u can ask other ppl which class that they like to meet 1vs 1 in war and which class nuker(wiz, fa) target 1st in mass war

darkrage
12-29-2010, 09:36 PM
The only con i can see in bl is the stun skill doesnt have a big aoe other then that bl rock im soloing stuff on my bl at lower lvls then i could on my fs or fb.

packetj
01-02-2011, 10:21 PM
we dont talk about bm1 or bm2 we are talking about how u roll in war and yes bm2 of bl is kinda useless in war so all u have left is bm1
in mass war when a wiz get root in the middle he still can use his skills man but bl cant or u can use TM and some cannon XD. FS and WA also have some range in their skill
well so how can u explain why there are no bl bringer also u can ask other ppl which class that they like to meet 1vs 1 in war and which class nuker(wiz, fa) target 1st in mass war

you don't know how to use it don't ya?

Tysukiomi
01-02-2011, 11:09 PM
we dont talk about bm1 or bm2 we are talking about how u roll in war and yes bm2 of bl is kinda useless in war so all u have left is bm1
in mass war when a wiz get root in the middle he still can use his skills man but bl cant or u can use TM and some cannon XD. FS and WA also have some range in their skill
well so how can u explain why there are no bl bringer also u can ask other ppl which class that they like to meet 1vs 1 in war and which class nuker(wiz, fa) target 1st in mass war

are you untalented with blader or just plain stupid
let someone mess with a decent geared/skilled blader in bm2+aura+intuition+curse dodge+intense blade+aof

Fhear
01-05-2011, 07:36 PM
What combo do you use for War? As well as PvE?

TouchMyOneInchBeast
01-11-2011, 02:49 AM
Pro They have two swords.
Con You will never be better then me at being a BL.
yup thats it pretty much. Bm2+Mirage Grind=1 hit Ko btw.

cadacus_ater
01-11-2011, 07:31 AM
Pro: They are a well balanced character in terms of stats and skill effects. They have a BEASTLY bm1 and bm2 offers good dps on bosses or other single targets. Great character for PvE and soloing stuff.
Con: I would put them at mid tier for pvp duels using no shorts or debuff, they can be outdone fairly easy by a decent WA, FS who crits hard or by a strong WI or FA if they do enough damage and can survive your attacks. FB are a tossup. In my experience FB usually have to be a bit stronger than the BL to win (FB stats aren't as good as BL in general except for rate and cdi). In War I think BL are possibly one of the hardest characters to use effectively as they have no clearly defined role in War, and Intuition =/= Shadow Shield QQ.

EDIT: Well, idk about duels, I don't really know how PvP goes with near-equal builds between BL and other classes. My pvp style relies on the way I've setup my skills, to optimize damage and dps, so I'm a little stronger in pvp than my stats might suggest. Also, since BL have a very good balance of hp and def, only WA and some FS outdo us easily in this category, we can survive against classes who have better dps skills in short matches (such as WI and FA).


What combo do you use for War? As well as PvE?

I personally end up using a 6 skill stun+down combo for pve due to my skill setup [all skills are 20, even Death Tempest (DT), except for Lightning Slash (LS 9) and Blade Scud (BS 9)]. For simplicity and to avoid confusion, I'll list other skill abreviations I'm using: DS=Double Slash, DR=Double Rising, SG=Storm Grind, IS=Impact Stab, VI=Vital Interfere, TMS=Twin Moon Slash, FK=Force Kick. It's a little bit tricky, but it loops very nicely (using the expanded skill bar really helps with combos like this, I just hold 'alt' to use one of the other 3 skills in my combo so I don't have to stretch or move my fingers) My pve combo is as follows:
--LS > DS > BS > VI > LS > DS > SG > DT > VI > LS > BS-- To continue beyond 11 skills, I can add SG > VI to the end and create a loop.

This combo is in my skill guide in the Blader section, titled "A Guide on All Skills to get for Bladers with Recommended Skill Levels". I have lots of skill and combo advice there. Also, I think there is a thread in the Blader section titled "100% stun lock for bladers" that has a good stunlock combo submitted by chainlock.

However if you don't have DT yet, and you want DR instead of DS and want simpler combos because you lag. One of the easiest combos you can do with BS 9 and LS 9 all other skills 20 is: --LS > SG > BS > DR (Repeat this over and over again)-- To add stun to this combo, try VI after DR.

If you have DT, a rule of thumb is that in simpler combos, you can usually use DT, SG, and DR interchangably. Depending on what level you put DT at you could use:
--LS > DT > BS > SG (Repeat this and if DT is not cooled by the time you come to it, use DR)-- Again try using VI before LS if you want to add stun.

As for War...I usually end up using my 6 skill pve combo cause I'm too lazy to come up with a War-specific combo. In War I don't think it really matters that much, people are moving and you're scrambling to adapt your combo anyway. You might try making a combo with more pursuit moves, like Assault. Sometimes I'll use a combo like --IS > VI > Assault > DT > LS > Assault > VI > BS > Assault > SG > LS-- ...or I'll just wing it.

ZEPR0
01-11-2011, 09:30 AM
high hp
high def
high attack
CD/CR built in skills
high def rate
high attack rate
highly customizable
beast buffs, low cooldowns




^^i just told you the pros because i cant think of any cons of bl

Cons: bl has the shortest skill range in Cabal
Not good in Mwar specially in big wars

jeckal
01-11-2011, 09:52 AM
there are no cons of blader

in NW bladers are fine i never had a issue on my blader in the 150-170 war

LeiKung
02-13-2011, 10:06 AM
I have a BL 153 and I love it in pve, good skills and stuff, but I hate going to TG because, when I come closer to one enemy in the way ppl kill me, or when attack one, 3 more attack me and I cant attack them at the same time (like a FS) so I cant make good points, resulting in dying a LOT. Its just plain boring to me, If I can find a way to kill ppl as easy as FS or other clases, I would stick with BL, but TG is making me wanna change my class to FS (just dont like its pve sort of boring)
What do I need to do a good role in war as a minimum? 1000 attack? 900 def? all skills 20? I dont know what to do really
yesterday I went to TG and started to do assault , double raising, double slash ... but those skills only made 30 or 40 dmg, my BL has 900 attack, so I cant understand, my 134 FS with crappy gear can outdmg my BL.

XFearMyBladeX
02-13-2011, 10:55 AM
Pro: They are a well balanced character in terms of stats and skill effects. They have a BEASTLY bm1 and bm2 offers good dps on bosses or other single targets. Great character for PvE and soloing stuff.
Con: I would put them at mid tier for pvp duels using no shorts or debuff, they can be outdone fairly easy by a decent WA, FS who crits hard or by a strong WI or FA if they do enough damage and can survive your attacks. FB are a tossup. In my experience FB usually have to be a bit stronger than the BL to win (FB stats aren't as good as BL in general except for rate and cdi). In War I think BL are possibly one of the hardest characters to use effectively as they have no clearly defined role in War, and Intuition =/= Shadow Shield QQ.

EDIT: Well, idk about duels, I don't really know how PvP goes with near-equal builds between BL and other classes. My pvp style relies on the way I've setup my skills, to optimize damage and dps, so I'm a little stronger in pvp than my stats might suggest. Also, since BL have a very good balance of hp and def, only WA and some FS outdo us easily in this category, we can survive against classes who have better dps skills in short matches (such as WI and FA).



I personally end up using a 6 skill stun+down combo for pve due to my skill setup [all skills are 20, even Death Tempest (DT), except for Lightning Slash (LS 9) and Blade Scud (BS 9)]. For simplicity and to avoid confusion, I'll list other skill abreviations I'm using: DS=Double Slash, DR=Double Rising, SG=Storm Grind, IS=Impact Stab, VI=Vital Interfere, TMS=Twin Moon Slash, FK=Force Kick. It's a little bit tricky, but it loops very nicely (using the expanded skill bar really helps with combos like this, I just hold 'alt' to use one of the other 3 skills in my combo so I don't have to stretch or move my fingers) My pve combo is as follows:
--LS > DS > BS > VI > LS > DS > SG > DT > VI > LS > BS-- To continue beyond 11 skills, I can add SG > VI to the end and create a loop.

This combo is in my skill guide in the Blader section, titled "A Guide on All Skills to get for Bladers with Recommended Skill Levels". I have lots of skill and combo advice there. Also, I think there is a thread in the Blader section titled "100% stun lock for bladers" that has a good stunlock combo submitted by chainlock.

However if you don't have DT yet, and you want DR instead of DS and want simpler combos because you lag. One of the easiest combos you can do with BS 9 and LS 9 all other skills 20 is: --LS > SG > BS > DR (Repeat this over and over again)-- To add stun to this combo, try VI after DR.

If you have DT, a rule of thumb is that in simpler combos, you can usually use DT, SG, and DR interchangably. Depending on what level you put DT at you could use:
--LS > DT > BS > SG (Repeat this and if DT is not cooled by the time you come to it, use DR)-- Again try using VI before LS if you want to add stun.

As for War...I usually end up using my 6 skill pve combo cause I'm too lazy to come up with a War-specific combo. In War I don't think it really matters that much, people are moving and you're scrambling to adapt your combo anyway. You might try making a combo with more pursuit moves, like Assault. Sometimes I'll use a combo like --IS > VI > Assault > DT > LS > Assault > VI > BS > Assault > SG > LS-- ...or I'll just wing it.


dude u the person who types the MOST on this forum..... lol

Tom Pham
02-19-2011, 10:20 AM
I have a BL 153 and I love it in pve, good skills and stuff, but I hate going to TG because, when I come closer to one enemy in the way ppl kill me, or when attack one, 3 more attack me and I cant attack them at the same time (like a FS) so I cant make good points, resulting in dying a LOT. Its just plain boring to me, If I can find a way to kill ppl as easy as FS or other clases, I would stick with BL, but TG is making me wanna change my class to FS (just dont like its pve sort of boring)
What do I need to do a good role in war as a minimum? 1000 attack? 900 def? all skills 20? I dont know what to do really
yesterday I went to TG and started to do assault , double raising, double slash ... but those skills only made 30 or 40 dmg, my BL has 900 attack, so I cant understand, my 134 FS with crappy gear can outdmg my BL.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=afG1iZYaJKM
Do this in a small tunnel with tons of Caps (i'm proc ftw =P)
+NW flee rate pot,NW defrate pot+flee rate buff+100% resis buff u'll see how interesting our class is ^.^

tsjay
03-03-2011, 04:55 AM
high hp
high def
high attack
CD/CR built in skills
high def rate
high attack rate
highly customizable
beast buffs, low cooldowns




^^i just told you the pros because i cant think of any cons of bl

high hp? yea pretty high but just not as high as WA
high def? yea way better than range class, but in melee class FS>WA>BL
high attack? WA's got the same attack with redosm weapon while a BL has 2hand forcy+11
high def/attack rate? this one is true but not real, is not like u can miss in combo
highly customizable? LOL really expensive to build one >_>
beast buffs? LOL, dont make me laugh...comparing cdi and rate buff ?? Yea maybe in the 25secs we are if shorts are allowed! LOL
CD/CR built in skills? its nice having that, but not all skills.How bout skills that have 100%cdi or 50% cdi and 90% down and stuns ? check out the +attack of LS and BS. Dont forget they 1range+Slow skill.

Only pros: Easiest to play/pve/lvling class. Cool looking.
Crushing blow in war is ridiculous! it does 6dmg on a WA with bm

Cons: LOL forget bout it, If there's a heavy range skill like Semic wave for BL/ or a 20% up CDI long buff, all cons will be acceptable!
AGREE??

ZEPR0
03-03-2011, 05:33 AM
great in everything that you could think of
except at Nwar they su.ck Big time prolly cos they got the shortest range

XFearMyBladeX
03-03-2011, 06:11 AM
when it comes to solo dungeons and bosses they r pro but free style/war/pk they I love you >.<♥I love you >.<♥I love you >.<♥I love you >.<♥ cuz of range

cadacus_ater
03-03-2011, 11:00 AM
Do this in a small tunnel with tons of Caps (i'm proc ftw =P)
+NW flee rate pot,NW defrate pot+flee rate buff+100% resis buff u'll see how interesting our class is ^.^

That is fun to do, however think twice about trying to do that on a res tower in a med base.
For me the stupid guard gets in my way so dang often that I'd be better off not retargeting (res towers have tricky hitboxes).

tsjay
03-03-2011, 12:45 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=afG1iZYaJKM
Do this in a small tunnel with tons of Caps (i'm proc ftw =P)
+NW flee rate pot,NW defrate pot+flee rate buff+100% resis buff u'll see how interesting our class is ^.^

Not like everybody could retarget, more important, not like you can miss when you combo, moreover, not like you can miss when u CRIT -.-