Amp to Atk ratio?

[SyndicateBlader]

So I need to decide. Right now, I'm using those +5 3% amp gloves you get from the quest.

Is 3% Amp better than 16 - 20 atk? Somebody tell meee.

[Lelouch]

go with the 16-20 attk gloves

[Sonic]

1amp = 1% of ur total atk
u have 1000 atk? 3amp = 30atk
u have 0500 atk? 3amp = 15atk

[forumtwizzler]

For those who don't understand :) this is how its done. 3% amp vs 15 atk case study


Trans skill : Upcoming shield Grenade for FS

Take the upcoming FS trans skill as an example 990 atk 90% amp @ lvl 15. Say you have 50% amp from gear, 1000 atk

3% amp
Total atk = 990 + 1000 = 1990 atk
Total amp = 53 + 90 = 143 amp

(1990 x 143 / 100) + 1990 = 2846 + 1990 = 4836
Base Damage on PvP vs. Enemy with 1k def = (4836 - 1000) / 4 = 959

Now 15 atk instead of 3% amp :

Total Atk = 990 + 1000 + 15 = 2005
Total Amp = 50 + 90 = 140

(2005 x 140 / 100) + 2005 = 4812
Base Damage on PvP vs. Enemy with 1k def = (4812 - 1000) / 4 = 953

The difference for base is not so much. 959 - 953 = 6.



Now for short atk like impact stab :

3% amp

Total atk = 1000 + 48 = 1048
Total amp = 50 + 35 + 3 = 88

(1048 x 88 / 100) + 1048 = 1970
Base Dmg in PvP vs 1k def enemy = (1970 - 1000) / 4 = 242

15 atk instead of 3% amp

Total atk = 1000 + 48 + 15 = 1063
Total amp = 50 + 35 = 85

(1063 x 85/100) + 1063 = 1967
Base dmg in pvp vs 1k def enemy = (1967 - 1000) / 4 = ~ 242

Dmg difference = 242 - 242 = 0



-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Conclusion :

High DPS atk, FK impact stab etc, vi for blader , force stab / rising for fs, lances cannons for magic class etc. 5 atk = 1% amp
Trans , Comp , GM skill 1% amp > 5 atk, almost looks by a little more than 6%.

So it seems like 1% amp ftw ? Slightly ?? WRONG ... here is why

NOTE :
1. if you have more amp, that surpass 50%, it will favor attack more. This will be the case with the new red k-board. Also if you have amp build that go 55% +, it will favor attack more than amp.
2. For sword classes : Minimum % dmg Contribute to dmg, and minimum dmg act only on base atk, however this only acts when you are not critting.

FINALLY SO based on NOTE , 5 atk = 1% amp , no difference.
For sword class, because of minimum dmg 5 atk > 1% amp.
For magic classes 1% amp > 5 atk (may be) . For magic classes ask a seasoned WI, FA.

But I think it's safe to assume 5 atk ~ 1% amp, where 5 atk is favored, AND this is also why bof6 > bof3 it makes a significant difference in dmg.

[Sonic]

true but those are all cases of pvp with skills
w/o pvp, in pve, amp would win in every situation based on your numbers there
we should also look at bm2 stats too, unless ur a wiz

3% amp

Total atk = 1300 (lets say in bm2)
Total amp = 50 + 3 = 53

(1300 x 53 / 100) + 1300 = 1989
Base Dmg in PvP vs 1k def enemy = (1989 - 1000) / 4 = 247.25
Base Dmg in PvE vs 1k def enemy = (1989 - 1000) = 989

15 atk

Total atk = 1300 + 15 = 1315
Total amp = 50 = 50

(1315 x 50 / 100) + 1315 = 1989
Base Dmg in PvP vs 1k def enemy = (1972.5 - 1000) / 4 = 243.125
Base Dmg in PvE vs 1k def enemy = (1989 - 1000) = 972.5

not much of a diff but 30atk would do 995 pve where 6 amp would do 1028 pve

60atk would do 1040 pve where 12 amp would do 1106 pve

and the difference keeps increasing, and we can do the same for skill use, no bm2


and realistically some1 looking at gaining atk in exchange for amp wouldn't have 50amp so the difference would be even greater
we should be comparing 1000atk 50amp vs 1016atk 43amp, or 1000atk 57amp vs 1016atk 50amp
and amp wins hands down

[forumtwizzler]

1. You are also forgetting about minimum dmg % which act only on base atk.
2. The ratio you presented in your case is out of proportion, read my post on red blue , to see dmg difference.

see if hands won hands down by the ratio you are pulling up, bof3 > bof6. that's not the case. and it's tested over and over. you can check the difference for yourself, I posted the numbers.

and it's quite realistic, look at my stat in my signature. pretty much 1k atk , 176% cd, 50% amp w/o red k - board. (scroll up to see my signature)

minimum dmg % + base atk > % amp for ratio of 5:1, meaning 5 atk and 1% amp.
for sword class 5 atk > 1% amp , slightly.

[Sonic]

1. You are also forgetting about minimum dmg % which act only on base atk.
2. The ratio you presented in your case is out of proportion, read my post on red blue , to see dmg difference.

see if hands won hands down by the ratio you are pulling up, bof3 > bof6. that's not the case. and it's tested over and over.

minimum dmg % + base atk > % amp for ratio of 5:1, meaning 5 atk and 1% amp.
for sword class 5 atk > 1% amp , slightly.

i didnt consider bof3 vs bof6, just what syn posted about his gloves

5atk may win over 1%amp but
7%amp would win over 35atk

amp multiplies where atk does not

so for the gloves stay with the 3%amp or get 7% o.o

[Sonic]

and it's quite realistic, look at my stat in my signature. pretty much 1k atk , 176% cd, 50% amp w/o red k - board. (scroll up to see my signature)

true but this thread is about syn's gloves so ud be giving up 7amp gloves for 16atk gloves

those stats are crazy too O.O

[forumtwizzler]

haha, my stats ? thanks. that's probably because i am an FS, our bm1/ 2 skills are poor and we have no debuffs.

anyway sonic , well here is something ... see minimum dmg makes a difference too , and minimum dmg % act only on base atk ? (correct me if i am wrong). and it doesn't work like
atk x min dmg x amp < it doesn't work like that if that's what you are assuming. more like (atk x amp) + (atk x extra min dmg from bofs w/e) on random scale of 80 to 100.
I think what I say is correct.

Ask yourself :

1. How much bof6 min dmg u get there ? (For those who don't know min dmg don't effect crits)
2. Now assume you crit 50% time and 50% you don't And 50% you don't the min dmg act like pure amp. So it's almost like 2% min% dmg = 1% amp acting on those attacks, assuming you crit 50%.


Syndicate is a blader (sword class) so minimum % dmg does make a differnce to him. I would say approx 15 atk ~ 3% amp. 16 - 20 > 3% amp no question about it.

[Sonic]

idk why were talking bout min damage or bof6s O.O

but yea min damage, capped at 15%, would work after def on non crits as a multiplier from 85% to 100% randomly (from what i understand)
its possible to hit max min damage even w/o any min damage

but that aside id still keep the 3%amp quest gloves rather than getting 16atk gloves if i were syndicate

[forumtwizzler]

because min dmg act on base, not on amp. if your atk is say "K" and i think the number is 20 not 15.

it's [K (random on 20%) + ( K x min % dmg)] x Amp - correct ? where K = Original atk + 15 , and based on "that 15" its min % dmg. Am I making any sense ? And am I correct ?

Why am i giving example of bof6, bof3 ? Simply an example, WHY ? BECAUSE Bof3 has 1% more amp and 7 less atk than bof6 and yet bof6 makes more way more damage.
So based on that I say 16 - 20 atk gloves ftw. over 3% amp. And I gave calculation and sub notes in on my post in page 1 to show why it is so.

[Sonic]

because min dmg act on base, not on amp. if your atk is say "K" and i think the number is 20 not 15.

it's [K (random on 20%) + ( K x min % dmg)] x Amp - correct ? where K = Original atk + 15 , and based on "that 15" its min % dmg. Am I making any sense ? And am I correct ?

Why am i giving example of bof6, bof3 ? Simply an example, WHY ? BECAUSE Bof3 has 1% more amp and 7 less atk than bof6 and yet bof6 makes more way more damage.
So based on that I say 16 - 20 atk gloves ftw. over 3% amp.

idk O.O
but i did use a friends bof6 and compared to my bof3 and got 1 more damage in pvp on a crit so ill agree
but i wonder which is better for high atk like in bm2, i didnt test that much

[forumtwizzler]

test it out :) tell us

[Matrimoney]

So I need to decide. Right now, I'm using those +5 3% amp gloves you get from the quest.

Is 3% Amp better than 16 - 20 atk? Somebody tell meee.

lool u know whats funny? i made a new acct and took all the syndicate names you hadnt taken already, have a nice day sir

[Sonic]

test it out :) tell us

i no longer have them atm D=
ill try a lil later


lool u know whats funny? i made a new acct and took all the syndicate names you hadnt taken already, have a nice day sir

i LOL'd
if thats true then thats just f*cked up

[SyndicateBlader]

So, based on ALL this. I've seen many opinions saying DON'T TAKE THE AMP or DON'T TAKE THE ATK. WTF DO I TAKE.
Please note, I am not fully geared yet. I have no BoF's or any of that fancy shmancy jazz. Maybe I shoulda mentioned that in the first post.

And Matrimoney. I would really laugh if you did haha. But too bad I already made all five other names, and they're sitting in my Character slots right now, sorry :x
If you had the chance though, I'd give your props for your humorous endeavor.