For Bm3 Orb: Amp or CD??

[providen1990]

Even with bm3 1amp > 2cd, if you have 1100atk, 55amp. Just calculate it like me you will see. When u aura and aos, the cd addition only make amp more important. (this for pvp only)
In pve field i suggest go for cd all the way

[forumtwizzler]

Even with bm3 1amp > 2cd, if you have 1100atk, 55amp. Just calculate it like me you will see. When u aura and aos, the cd addition only make amp more important. (this for pvp only)
In pve field i suggest go for cd all the way

Someone correct me if I am wrong. I am going to do this old school

Damage = [(atk (atk x amp / 100 ) - Defense )/ 4 ]
Ciritcal Dmg = Dmg + (CD * Dmg / 100)

[10% amp vs 20 % cd ]

Say you have 60 % amp 1100 m atk and 90 cd on a player with 1200, say you are using a skill with 75 amp, and 115 atk

CASE 1 : Atk = 1100 + 115 = 1215 , Amp = 60 + 75 = 135 CD = 90

Damage = [1215 + (1215 x 135 / 100) - 1200 ] / 4 = 413
CD = 413 + (413 * 90/100) = 784

Provided you crit half the time avg dmg = ( 784 + 413 / 2 ) = 598.5

Now say you have 50% amp and 110% cd on the same skill

CASE 2 : Atk = 1100 + 115 = 1215 Amp = 50 + 75 = 125 CD = 110

Damage = [1215 + (1215 *125 / 100) - 1200 ] / 4 = 383
CD = 383 + (383 * 110 / 100) = 804

Provided you crit half the time avg dmg = 593.5

Now all damage is some amplified version of this, depending if you are in war , pvp or pve. This has always worked for me.

The dps ofcourse = avg dmg / time of skill in seconds.

Yeah sooo 593.5 vs 598.5 ... , 1 amp > 2 cd MARGINALLY, So it's fair to say 1 amp = 2cd. The damage will be some amplificaiton of that depending on the environment.


Now you can go crazy by saying hnr has rate resist, people go aura / bm in nation wars, tanks have 1300 + def, others will argue of having a high max rate, availability of weapons i.e. 7% amp craft vs 16% cd , 16% cd > 7 amp easily etc ... whatever. To me the BEST dmg comes from 3 slot bike filled with m atk / amp, and 2 siggy weps one 7% amp 24 cd and other 40% cd +15 ed, 60% max rate and 2 rate rings. It's far superior than any 2 slot cd 3 amp orbs +11 with k-red. Have fun flaming me

[Cathy]

Even with bm3, 1 Amp > 2 Cd, by definition of math.

"Associative Property: When three or more numbers are multiplied, the product is the same regardless of the grouping of the factors."

2 Cd > 1 Amp only in the case of a skill with more than 1500~ish add attack. Even bm3 skills only give 1000~ish add attack.

[forumtwizzler]

Even with bm3, 1 Amp > 2 Cd, by definition of math.

"Associative Property: When three or more numbers are multiplied, the product is the same regardless of the grouping of the factors."

2 Cd > 1 Amp only in the case of a skill with more than 1500~ish add attack. Even bm3 skills only give 1000~ish add attack.

Your logic and application of Associative Property is faulty. I don't want to give a full lecture on what it means and how it is applied. To make it easier ask any WA / FB to pick up amp forci weps instead of crit dmg weps they will not agree.


FB and WA have high attacks, correct ? And they are naturally inclined to choose damage weapons.
Similarly BM3 of FA have high attack, and you should be inclined towards critical damage.


With BL their case might be slightly difference beceause their bm2 has fast low base attack like FA bm2.


Here are some additional facts.

Fact 1 : The most successful bringers of these classes, 90% of them have used critical damage type weapons over amp weapons.

Fact 2 : So why has it worked with FA ?

a) Bm2 for its low base but because it has a high rate of attack , (fast damage per second i.e. for dps) and slight increase of amp has made a significant difference.

b) Lance (low base attack) supports high amp

c) High amp is not an all negative factor, it contributes nicely to bm3. But not as much as CD builds.

In short : Low base attacks favor amp. And because they have fast casting time it means they have a high dps. It agrees to your fact why a high attack would favor critical damage. 1500 ? Too much. In all Amp Forcium Orbs Still Work ! But it certainly does not favor BM3. To me my logic still stands firm , 1 amp = 2 cd. My calculations above where I have chosen x as a factor = 4 shows the difference in damage and it's negligible. Assuming the attack skill chosen has a 1 second time cast you can call them, comparison by dps.

The forum topic says : BM3 : amp or cd , I Vote CD.

[providen1990]

There are lots of scenario that make 2cd > 1 amp and also vice versa, but as for now, amp is better for FA in most case.
BTW the result is 1amp > 2cd most ppl agree on this so go for it. Unless you just want PVE...

[Cathy]

Your logic and application of Associative Property is faulty. I don't want to give a full lecture on what it means and how it is applied. To make it easier ask any WA / FB to pick up amp forci weps instead of crit dmg weps they will not agree.


FB and WA have high attacks, correct ? And they are naturally inclined to choose damage weapons.
Similarly BM3 of FA have high attack, and you should be inclined towards critical damage.


With BL their case might be slightly difference beceause their bm2 has fast low base attack like FA bm2.


Here are some additional facts.

Fact 1 : The most successful bringers of these classes, 90% of them have used critical damage type weapons over amp weapons.

Fact 2 : So why has it worked with FA ?

a) Bm2 for its low base but because it has a high rate of attack , (fast damage per second i.e. for dps) and slight increase of amp has made a significant difference.

b) Lance (low base attack) supports high amp

c) High amp is not an all negative factor, it contributes nicely to bm3. But not as much as CD builds.

In short : Low base attacks favor amp. And because they have fast casting time it means they have a high dps. It agrees to your fact why a high attack would favor critical damage. 1500 ? Too much. In all Amp Forcium Orbs Still Work ! But it certainly does not favor BM3. To me my logic still stands firm , 1 amp = 2 cd. My calculations above where I have chosen x as a factor = 4 shows the difference in damage and it's negligible. Assuming the attack skill chosen has a 1 second time cast you can call them, comparison by dps.

The forum topic says : BM3 : amp or cd , I Vote CD.

I never said anything about using Forcium amp weapons, but then you'd have to define how much amp on weapon. I guaruntee using a 5 amp craft will be beneficial over a 10 damage craft. And a 1 amp in slot in pet, is better than a 2 cd in slot in pet. So long as the ratio is 1:2, the amp is better.

[forumtwizzler]

@ providen1990

I would say it's the complete opposite. Because again, calculations above, in PvE the number x = 4 is reduced. So amp favors high dps attacks such as lance in 1 2 3 combo, and bm2 and so it favors PvE and so you are correct that amp builds work well for FA.

@Cathy

So long the ratio is 1:2 amp is slightly better. But not significantly better. That's my point. And since going back to the forum topic, it's cd vs amp, for bm3 cd type weapons is the way to go provided he meets the base requirements. I only disagree, when you say 2 cd > 1 amp significantly. As long as he meets certain requirements, if he finds something around 7 amp over 16 cd , he should choose 16 cd.

Ask yourself, what do you use, 16 % craft helmet right ? And not 7 % amp helmet. The ratio is like around 2.25 : 1 ?

If you ask 15 cd vs 7 amp THEN it's debatable.
But if you ask 16 cd 7 amp I say cd.
If yoy say 20% cd vs 7 amp I say cd

And since there is nothing called 10% amp weapon or 8% amp helmet, the way to go is cd. However choosing anything below a pc siggy is not recommended. Ideally the MINIMUM should be around 55% amp and 1150 m atk. If he is going 2x siggy , he needs 60 m atk bike, if he goes 2x forcium orb k red is okay. The max rate has to hit 60%. The rate ideally comes from rings where you can switch them during aos and aura.

Provided he can surpass the opponent defense by a reasonable margin, holding 2 cd = 1 amp is a safe bet provided he can crit at least half the time (60% rate).Disagree ? Then how about 2.1 cd = 1 amp. Still close enough !