Could it be true?

[TeaParty]

still OP prove me wrong, it needs to be nerfed moar

Their root cool down is already a good enough nerf. I'm pretty sure all FBs are root/debuff dependent since that's all they have and do not have any shorts to guarantee their viability on the spot. Also, their Mana Freeze has become obsolete as many people are now (and probably a while ago) resistant to it.

[justice]

yea I didn't want to bother "whining" about root since im aware wat forums r like but since it's been brought up imma give my 2 cents. personally I think root has been "over"nerfed with this recent update. the only nerf that should've occurred was that root still goes on cd if it fails, but the shared cd is just ridiculous and this is my reasoning y:

1. altho one does target up to 3 players having 2 skills that share the same cd is stupid logic wise (in the sense that it kinda defeats the purpose of having 2 separate skills considering fbs need all the skill points they can get altho I do appreciate that it does add some "strategic" factors to it I suppose albeit stupid ones. also thought i'd just say it here too since I mentioned fbs lacking skill points. does anyone else think it'd be logical if for fb they combined blind and darkness into 1 debuff?)

2. since u cannot control which other 2 ppl get rooted out of the group that u attempt to mass root u might just end up with the same effect as a single root if the other 2 randomly selected targets have resist buffs, pots, etc. but with a ridiculous cd (perhaps they could figure out a way to allow fb to choose the 3 targets that r within aoe and range to root)

3. they should allow ppl to c whether or not someone is using resist pots cuz it's unfair for an fb to waste root and have it shared cd just because they have no way of knowing (no fb, or at least I hope no fb would ever bother using root on a target that's using resist pots)

4. the new system has made the game more defensive than it used to be with natural resists, new/changed buffs, evasion, dmg reduction, etc. --->case in point a bl can stall out 12s of root with intuiton or just use natural hiding, curse dodge, etc.; an fa can use curse remove with the sameish cd as single root so u can nvr trap an fa due to shared cd by urself and can also rely on quick move or heal spam; wa has ii and bears; wi has the new ss and high regen; fs has (improved) aod and (improved) ss if pt member in range; lastly fb has no defensive counters but can maybe mf if he's lucky, aoc with lightning blade or root to try and defend/stall (things might balance out for fb a bit defensively when that new short comes along in part 3, will have to c). ofc there r offensive ways to stall out root too with the new status effects silence and suppression.

just my 2 cents. hope it wasn't too long of a read altho I do have more things to say about the subject.

[MamaMiaYoe]

As long as there are people who call other people "noob" or "pro" there will always be drama.

[BamOwnage]

Mia it is pos in Cabal remember?

[Faowin]

even the "legendary" kav has been quiet too

Nope, I saw him shouting a few days ago on his usual "noob fbs" rant. You just don't have to be on at midnight.

[alhifnawy3]

Didn't u see the drama between wrecka and skylar?!!

[BamOwnage]

Wasn't that great, could've been better

[alhifnawy3]

yeah but still drama

[Enso]

yea I didn't want to bother "whining" about root since im aware wat forums r like but since it's been brought up imma give my 2 cents. personally I think root has been "over"nerfed with this recent update. the only nerf that should've occurred was that root still goes on cd if it fails, but the shared cd is just ridiculous and this is my reasoning y:

1. altho one does target up to 3 players having 2 skills that share the same cd is stupid logic wise (in the sense that it kinda defeats the purpose of having 2 separate skills considering fbs need all the skill points they can get altho I do appreciate that it does add some "strategic" factors to it I suppose albeit stupid ones. also thought i'd just say it here too since I mentioned fbs lacking skill points. does anyone else think it'd be logical if for fb they combined blind and darkness into 1 debuff?)

2. since u cannot control which other 2 ppl get rooted out of the group that u attempt to mass root u might just end up with the same effect as a single root if the other 2 randomly selected targets have resist buffs, pots, etc. but with a ridiculous cd (perhaps they could figure out a way to allow fb to choose the 3 targets that r within aoe and range to root)

3. they should allow ppl to c whether or not someone is using resist pots cuz it's unfair for an fb to waste root and have it shared cd just because they have no way of knowing (no fb, or at least I hope no fb would ever bother using root on a target that's using resist pots)

4. the new system has made the game more defensive than it used to be with natural resists, new/changed buffs, evasion, dmg reduction, etc. --->case in point a bl can stall out 12s of root with intuiton or just use natural hiding, curse dodge, etc.; an fa can use curse remove with the sameish cd as single root so u can nvr trap an fa due to shared cd by urself and can also rely on quick move or heal spam; wa has ii and bears; wi has the new ss and high regen; fs has (improved) aod and (improved) ss if pt member in range; lastly fb has no defensive counters but can maybe mf if he's lucky, aoc with lightning blade or root to try and defend/stall (things might balance out for fb a bit defensively when that new short comes along in part 3, will have to c). ofc there r offensive ways to stall out root too with the new status effects silence and suppression.

just my 2 cents. hope it wasn't too long of a read altho I do have more things to say about the subject.

(I am going to assume Field of Execration has a cool down of 180 seconds, because I haven't played a Force Blader since the update, I don't know the actual cool. And I'm not in a position to just ask someone at the moment, if I discover otherwise, I will edit where appropriate.)

I like some of your points, and while I do agree overall that having both roots share a cool down is a bad move, I think you're over reacting.

I'll go point by point.

1. If you think it is stupid "logic wise", I would love to hear more on that. I didn't see you really attack the logic of it, mostly just complain about skill points. What is it about making Force Bladers use root a little more sparingly that is "stupid"? That seems to indicate that you just don't like it, which is does not show anything about the logic. For instance, I don't like the suppression effect of Shield Charge (that's the skill with suppression, right?) but that makes it neither illogical nor stupid.

2. I actually think being able to see what potions someone is using would be really useful. (If they're using evasion potions against my BM2, for example.) But I can do without it. I think that the random target argument is a little weak. Whomever your targeting might have those potions as well. Same goes for single root, with or without combined cool down. I'm not sure if you're arguing against potions/buffs here, or the combined cool down. It seems like the former to me.

3. (See point 2, they didn't seem like discrete points to me.)

4. I don't think so. *All* stats got boosted, the patch notes said that skill amp got boosted as well. I didn't come back until after the update, so I can't say about the damage output before/after. I assume you experienced a decrease in damage after the update. I am also assuming that decreasing damage taken/more HP is what you would call "more defensive". You complain about not being able to "trap" a Force Archer—why is that so special? Out of the possible one versus one combinations, only five out of 36 can be "trapped". In a war situation, it is not uncommon for Force Archers to get "double rooted". In that case, they *are* trapped. Since you mentioned "heal spam", I assume you're talking about PK, since that tactic is useless in war and impossible in PvP. All classes are affected equally by suppression/silence, and I don't think they are often used to "stall" root. If I were trying to use a skill effect to "stall" another class from using a skill (be it root or whatever), knock down/knock back come to mind first, and work just as well as silence/suppress in many situations if that is the only goal (which, again, it rarely is, if at all). I would say the difference between an "offensive" or a "defensive" counter is smaller than you make it out to be. Back when I was a martial Force Archer, I had less than 700 defense, but my attack power meant I could kill people before they had a chance to take advantage of my weak defense. I would call (Field of) Execration a "defensive" counter, as well as all debuffs which decrease the attacking power of your opponent (Field of Enervation and Mana Freeze, among others).

It is possible this has to do with understanding how to play a Force Blader, as well. Of course, I can't judge anyone's skill on Force Blader, but I do see examples of a fundamental misunderstanding of how Force Bladers' skills work. I see Force Bladers use Field of Execration when I am the only person around, root a Force Archer at full health and continue debuffing instead of attacking while they unroot themselves, use Mana Freeze on characters with the Force Increase buff that are level 160+, use Blind while I am in the middle of a combo and then attack me (instead of running, where blind would actually hinder my ability to kill them), etc.

Over the course of a war, if you do nothing but use Field of Execration, at 180 second cool down, every time it comes up, and maximize its effectiveness (three targets), you can root 50 ( floor(((50*60)/180)*3) ) enemy players. If you use only Execration, you can root 64 ( floor((50*60)/46.5) ) enemy players. (Cast time isn't important since the cool down starts as soon as you activate the skill, not after it is done casting.) If I go back to Force Blader, I might remove the Field of Execration skill entirely, since the only reason I can think of to root more than one person is if there is a Force Archer, and some other class, and I want to make sure at least one is rooted. But even then, the 180 second cool down is a steep price to pay for one kill.

Just my two cents, of course, and largely opinion based. Though if there are numbers that are off, I would love to be corrected on those.

[justice]

(I am going to assume Field of Execration has a cool down of 180 seconds, because I haven't played a Force Blader since the update, I don't know the actual cool. And I'm not in a position to just ask someone at the moment, if I discover otherwise, I will edit where appropriate.)

I like some of your points, and while I do agree overall that having both roots share a cool down is a bad move, I think you're over reacting.

I'll go point by point.

1. If you think it is stupid "logic wise", I would love to hear more on that. I didn't see you really attack the logic of it, mostly just complain about skill points. What is it about making Force Bladers use root a little more sparingly that is "stupid"? That seems to indicate that you just don't like it, which is does not show anything about the logic. For instance, I don't like the suppression effect of Shield Charge (that's the skill with suppression, right?) but that makes it neither illogical nor stupid.

2. I actually think being able to see what potions someone is using would be really useful. (If they're using evasion potions against my BM2, for example.) But I can do without it. I think that the random target argument is a little weak. Whomever your targeting might have those potions as well. Same goes for single root, with or without combined cool down. I'm not sure if you're arguing against potions/buffs here, or the combined cool down. It seems like the former to me.

3. (See point 2, they didn't seem like discrete points to me.)

4. I don't think so. *All* stats got boosted, the patch notes said that skill amp got boosted as well. I didn't come back until after the update, so I can't say about the damage output before/after. I assume you experienced a decrease in damage after the update. I am also assuming that decreasing damage taken/more HP is what you would call "more defensive". You complain about not being able to "trap" a Force Archer—why is that so special? Out of the possible one versus one combinations, only five out of 36 can be "trapped". In a war situation, it is not uncommon for Force Archers to get "double rooted". In that case, they *are* trapped. Since you mentioned "heal spam", I assume you're talking about PK, since that tactic is useless in war and impossible in PvP. All classes are affected equally by suppression/silence, and I don't think they are often used to "stall" root. If I were trying to use a skill effect to "stall" another class from using a skill (be it root or whatever), knock down/knock back come to mind first, and work just as well as silence/suppress in many situations if that is the only goal (which, again, it rarely is, if at all). I would say the difference between an "offensive" or a "defensive" counter is smaller than you make it out to be. Back when I was a martial Force Archer, I had less than 700 defense, but my attack power meant I could kill people before they had a chance to take advantage of my weak defense. I would call (Field of) Execration a "defensive" counter, as well as all debuffs which decrease the attacking power of your opponent (Field of Enervation and Mana Freeze, among others).

It is possible this has to do with understanding how to play a Force Blader, as well. Of course, I can't judge anyone's skill on Force Blader, but I do see examples of a fundamental misunderstanding of how Force Bladers' skills work. I see Force Bladers use Field of Execration when I am the only person around, root a Force Archer at full health and continue debuffing instead of attacking while they unroot themselves, use Mana Freeze on characters with the Force Increase buff that are level 160+, use Blind while I am in the middle of a combo and then attack me (instead of running, where blind would actually hinder my ability to kill them), etc.

Over the course of a war, if you do nothing but use Field of Execration, at 180 second cool down, every time it comes up, and maximize its effectiveness (three targets), you can root 50 ( floor(((50*60)/180)*3) ) enemy players. If you use only Execration, you can root 64 ( floor((50*60)/46.5) ) enemy players. (Cast time isn't important since the cool down starts as soon as you activate the skill, not after it is done casting.) If I go back to Force Blader, I might remove the Field of Execration skill entirely, since the only reason I can think of to root more than one person is if there is a Force Archer, and some other class, and I want to make sure at least one is rooted. But even then, the 180 second cool down is a steep price to pay for one kill.

Just my two cents, of course, and largely opinion based. Though if there are numbers that are off, I would love to be corrected on those.

going to keep this as short as I can because im not interested in arguing differences of opinion, specially over the internet. with my first point there was an interview with a dev saying that the purpose of an fb was to disable opponents and open up opportunites for their teammates. with that in mind don't you think it's counterproductive and illogical to make both fb's root share the same cd ? y doesn't other skills with the same effects share cd? now if wat they're getting at is to promote better teamplay by making more fbs needed it works with a large community of players but on our server it fails. with language barriers, egos and small population u wont have many fbs at ur disposal and coordinating fb roots, etc. is almost impossible because of this.

im not against the use of potions, in pvp an fb is fairly root reliant, not being able to see whether an opponent is using immunity pots or not is quite the handicap because u will end up wasting ur root and eating the cool down time (on both skills) because of it. allowing the ability to c whether or not an opponent is using an immunity pot is a minor fix that allows the fb to adjust accordingly and save its root for a more vulnerable target. instead we're stuck shooting blindly and hoping it works. now I understand with natural resists it can still fail but unlike someone using an immunity pot it's not 100% and at that point at least the fb has the discretion of trying and hoping it works or saving it for something else.

anyways im going to stop there and not because I have no rebuttal for the rest but rather id prefer not bother arguing it. like I said the point of my post wasn't to "whine" or "overreact" in ur words but to just bring up things ive noticed because the subject was brought about.